SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

According to a quick google search, women can get trich via non-sexual transmission if they share things like damp towels or… bath water. But for that to happen, somebody else with trich needs to get the microscopic nasties on the towel or share the bath water. Both of those things seem unlikely to have happened.

I had it once when I was 18. I got it from another woman during a threesome, and the symptoms (horrific itching and pain) showed up exactly 28 days later, which is the maximum amount of time it can take. I don’t know if that information is helpful at all to you when examining your timeline or not, but I thought I’d mention it. Sorry you were exposed to that.

Ghostie: I’ve read the same thing. It is likely that WW got intimate with the friend she was visiting or were sharing toys or… who knows. I do know that non sexual trich contraction is really rare.

The biggest issue for me as a BH is that she is deceiving me again. Meeting with a divorce coach and found she is gathering financial statements. She has always said if we split, she would like a collaborative process. That’s only possible if she isn’t lying and going around my back.

I think this is over. I’m going to see if we can at least start a non-contentious divorce.

I think this is over. I’m going to see if we can at least start a non-contentious divorce.

Hope for the best, but ABSOLUTELY prepare for the worst.

Sorry for all you’ve gone thru. I just feel compelled to comment on your MC. It seems like from your writing that you regard an MC like an unbiased expert guide. I think that is a reasonable expectation, but it is often way way off. I experienced similar things with MC’s, they all seemed more sympathetic to my WW than me. Yours seems particularly egregious. Sisoon was correct, worse than incompetent. A small number of people here have said that a really good MC helped by holding the wayward accountable to stop the DARVO bullshit. The rest of us got buried deeper by therapists doing exactly the wrong things. Most of them aren’t prepared for a victim/abuser dynamic, they want to assume equal fault and work on tools. That doesn’t work at all with infidelity. Recommend in the strongest terms stopping those sessions with that MC.

I’ve been thinking through several of the themes that the MC has articulated. "This isn’t a type of abuse." "You have both been through so much." I think MC is approaching the marriage as needing communication tools and fixes instead of infidelity repair and reconciliation.

This is why MC is advised against in most cases, and the BS learns the hard way in most cases.

Now you too can join us in not recommending MC to the BS.

The MC assumes (for whatever reason?) that the WS is telling the truth and just looking to be understood. When you put an abuser and the abused on equal footing like that, it just turns into victim blaming and retraumatization.

Imagine an MC asking you to be nicer to your wife in a conflict to stop her from hitting you and that she only hits you because she doesn't felt heard...

To most MCs, anything is just a matter of better communication. That only works if you are both honest and both working towards a better marriage for both of you. If one person is willing to lie and is working towards whatever benefits them the most, they will basically be able to weaponize MC and the tools against you.

Reading your posts here just now clearly, and I mean very clearly, shows the marriage has been over for a long time. Every single thing you've written supports that reality.

I admire you looking out for your kids but to do that long term you also need to look out for yourself and set them a good example that they should be nobody's doormat when they get older. Please seize the initiative ASAP. It will help your self esteem as well as your outcome in what is to come. If you taking control shocks her back to the marriage, which it does sometimes, you can decide what to do then. But from what you've shared, she's been fully checked out and only the inertia produced by her busy schedule is keeping her there at all.

It has been a rollercoaster this month! We have had a gap in MC and have actually been doing better "on our own."

Then came the next problem. I couldn’t shake the feeling that WW was hiding something again. I did some digging and snooping and she has hired a divorce coach and paid for it with some unknown source.

I talked to her about it and she has set up a bank account at another bank in secret. She has been paying for "things she doesn’t want me to know about" with the account and says this is normal. She offered to show me her balance and I said that only a complete account history would show anything.

We have always had joint accounts and have talked about separate spending accounts in the past, but never where the existence and activity is secret. This seems like a huge breach of trust and another red flag.

I feel like a fool. I wanted so badly to reconcile and her behavior is consistently countering any gains we make in MC.

Would you consider this a big problem? She says it was a conscious choice and she would do it again. She did say she was sorry I felt hurt by it.

BTW: she is the primary income earner. I handle most of our finances. She has full access to all funds. I am not controlling our money or her spending.

she has hired a divorce coach…Would you consider this a big problem?

Only if you wanted to stay married.

A secret bank account.
Not a good sign for your marriage.
And hiring a divorce coach, what is that all about?
Looks like it's time for you to think about finding your own lawyer.

I wanted so badly to reconcile and her behavior is consistently countering any gains we make in MC.

You are slowly discovering why, no matter how desperately you want it, you cannot force reconciliation on an unwilling spouse. When her actions directly contradict her words, why do you listen to her words? Her actions SCREAM she wants out, and is actively working toward that end.

Are you going to let her dictate all of the terms of the D as well?

Are you still no love no touch?

...no matter how desperately you want it, you cannot force reconciliation on an unwilling spouse.

Rivers, it's time to go to the mattresses. Hardcore 180. Start to detach from your WW, who is clearly preparing for a divorce. Separate your finances. Consult a divorce attorney ASAP.

FILE FOR DIVORCE FIRST

Do not let her know.

I'm sorry you've reached this point, brother. I'm sure it's extremely fucking painful. You're in an untenable situation and the sooner you start to take control of your own life the sooner you can move on to a happier, healthier, peaceful life.

Yes; still no love, touch, cuddle, hand holding. This month, she did initiate sitting close once and then holding my hand after she went on a bender. I then tried to initiate holding her hand and got a "No thank you. What are you doing?" From her.

She says she wants to reconcile and rebuild the marriage, but is waiting for safety, feelings of affection and love, and to no longer experience distrust from me.

I could plot a steady decrease in my interest in reconciling with her. After the shock of DDay wore down. I jumped into it and it was incredibly difficult for me. She has stayed aloof and wanting lots of change from me. She thinks she has her shit together…

I did have a good conversation about MC in my IC. My IC said that often MC will repeatedly engage the spouse most open to change with prodding to change. Any changes often create change in the relationship dynamics. What isn’t fair is in the case of infidelity, it is usually the BS that is most open to change. If this dynamic continues for too long, the BS feels blamed. 😔

What isn’t fair is in the case of infidelity, it is usually the BS that is most open to change.

I don't know how you have come to this conclusion or what reasons you base it upon. It was certainly not my experience and after a decade on this site I have absolutely no reason, at all, to believe it.

The betrayal of infidelity changes us, whether we choose to change or not.

I hate to say it like this. It seems to me that she's got you wrapped around her fingers so tightly you can't even think straight.

I don't know how you have come to this conclusion or what reasons you base it upon. It was certainly not my experience and after a decade on this site I have absolutely no reason, at all, to believe it.

If I read it right, he's saying his IC told him that. "The betrayed spouse is generally the one most open to change," and I'm wondering of it might be somewhat accurate. At least in the cases where the BS wants to salvage the marriage, buys into the idea that he or she "caused their spouse to cheat," and is willing to do whatever it takes to save the relationship. We see BS' blame themselves pretty often here. I've seen folks suggest that MC's, the not so good ones, might indeed go that route in the name of saving the marriage. I read that as an advertisement to avoid MC in cases of infidelity, which is oft repeated here.

At least in the cases where the BS wants to salvage the marriage, buys into the idea that he or she "caused their spouse to cheat," and is willing to do whatever it takes to save the relationship.

The key changes that a BS can make are understanding that

1) the WS alone is responsible for their A;
2) it takes 2 to R.

There are a lot of myths about BSes. These points start to cut through the myths.

It's essential for BSes to accept that they've been victimized. It's equally essential for BSes to understand they have not been cast in the Victim role in a a Drama Triangle. We've been cast into despair, but we can get out of despair and live good lives.

One step in getting out of despair is accepting responsibility for ourselves and for getting ourselves out of despair. It takes a lot of work, but it's worth every erg of effort.

[Quote]My IC said that often MC will repeatedly engage the spouse most open to change with prodding to change. Any changes often create change in the relationship dynamics.

I got this a lot in the beginning from our MC. I have been in therapy since I was 15 years old. The MC point blank told me that I had more "bandwidth" for what was needed. I told her in no uncertain terms that I wouldn't do it. It's not my job to make my H feel safe and fix him. That's his job. If that's what he needs, it's not happening. We're on our 3rd MC ,but not because we fired the others. We've moved and our MCs have moved. They were all very surprised by what I said at first, but they came around.

We are at a point now in MC where we are both able to do what we need for ourselves and each other.

I have a lot of experience with therapy. I can tell you that you need to be steadfast in your convictions about protecting yourself in the face of infidelity. The BP has to refuse take on any responsibility for the WP's lying and cheating.

[This message edited by cocoplus5nuts at 1:09 AM, Saturday, December 27th]

The MC point blank told me that I had more "bandwidth" for what was needed.

More bandwidth to change, I can accept.

Since R requires the WS to stop lying and to change from betrayer to good partner, how can the BS have more bandwidth for what is needed? Unless the MC means the BS can change enough to establish requirements for R and to walk if the WS doesn't meet them. Is that what your MC meant? Did you stay with that MC? How did it work out? (I ask knowing you are not obliged to answer....)

Sisoon,

That was an old MC from years ago. She started out as my IC. Ultimately, she meant that I had the ability to make changes to myself that my H didn't have. I had already been in therapy for over 20 years by then. I had a lot of knowledge, experience, and had learned a lof of skills that my H had never been exposed to.

What she wanted me to change was my presentation towards my H. She wanted me to soften myself so that he would feel safer. I told her that I could do that and I absolutely would not. We were not at a point in any of the 3 RS (relationship, recovery, reconciliation) where I was willing to do that for my H.

By this time, my H was not a betrayer anymore. He was trying to be honest. He was trying to do what was needed. He was(is) also so weak and fearful and had such a fragile ego that there was a lot he was struggling to be real about.

We're with another MC that we've been seeing for several years now. I had to take her through an adjustment period as well. I am very confident in my convictions. I have a very small number of them that I absolutely will not bend. The therapists can either accept that and work within my boundaries or they can choose not to see me.

Thanks for the clarification.

I didn't find an IC for weeks after d-day. I doubt that I could have become softer toward my W at the time. Fortunately, our MC didn't suggest it. :-)